Pan EU Political Parties: 05-Jun-2011 - UKIP PEPP Debate Was Insultingly Amateur & Crassly Illinformed!

05-Jun-2011 - UKIP PEPP Debate Was Insultingly Amateur & Crassly Illinformed!
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Clean EUkip up NOW make UKIP electable!
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The corruption of EUkip’s leadership,

their anti UKIP claque in POWER & the NEC

is what gives the remaining 10% a bad name!
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UKIP PEPP Debate Was Insultingly Amateur & Crassly Illinformed!

It was astonishing just how irresponsible such highly paid individuals can be!!
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Hi,

PLEASE NOTE:
The vote on this issue will be circulated in Mid July in the in house comic - INDEPENDENCE NEWS which is used, on track record, for corrupt Farage propaganda but rarely appears on time with excuses usually being made based upon lack of funding (As with The NEC Elections of last February which still have not yet been held!)

The theory is that Ballot Papers will be distributed during July to all members and the completed those being returned by mid August will be counted as a part of the vote.

I have just watched the full debate of UKIP as chaired by Steve Crowther at The Tiverton Hotel which ended at 15:55hrs.

Protagonists:

Trevor Colman MEP - NO

Stuart Agnew MEP - YES

Stephanie Williams - YES

Mike Smith - NO

May I congratulate Mike Smith for having the integrity to thank Nikki Sinclaire, Mike Nattrass and Trevor colman for their sterling work in bringing the facts of The EU to the attention of both members and the public - having not lost sight of the reason they were elected.

I was amazed at the lack of facts, lack of information and emotive nature of the debate from both sides of the rather mumbled arguments, beyond the admonishment to read the Legislation for yourself - with which I do agree but it was unfortunate that the two sides were not adequately in command of their brief to respond with linkage in other than their set piece presentation section.

That Stuart Agnew clearly stated he did not care about the outcome of the democratic vote of the members he, like Godfrey Bloom would willingly betray the principles of Democracy in UKIP such as it is and if the vote was NO to PEPPs he personally would still join one!

Some will remember that I warned before his election that Stuart Agnew was untrustworthy, dishonest, corrupt and self interested. He colluded in corruption to be placed upon the list of candidates as one of Farage's placements based on Farage's comment 'He is as thick as sh*t but he's got money'.

No I never expected Stuart Agnew to act in an honourable or principled manner on ANY issue - a point soon highlighted by The Sunday Times and I understand still a subject of OLAF enquiry in terms of his boassted of fraud together with his equally dishonest and corrupt partner in fraud David Bannerman.

I presume Stuart Agnews puppet masters the NFU wish him to aid and assist their paymasters The EU by helping The EU in its greater goal to undermine National Politics by controlling Pan EU Political Parties via their bribes and purse strings to the MEP's overseas accounts and perks.

It was stunning to listen to these 4 protagonists waffling on with so little knowledge or understanding of either The EU, ethics, principles or even the rules as laid out by The EU for PEPPs which can be read in full if you CLICK HERE

They seemed not to have a clue what their own UKIP MEP was upto which speaks volumes of the loss of control when prostituted to The EU and funded as a Supra National Political Party - we are currently at the stage where UKIP Chairman and two UKIP MEPs haven't a clue what Godfrey Bloom is doing - just as they hadn't a clue that David Bannerman had gone on a jolly with the Tories to Taiwan!

To have SOME incling of what Godfrey Bloom is upto, although his web site has not been materially updated since last year! You may be will find this helps understand how he is subsuming himself into The EU when not copulating with prostitutes in the streets nor urinating in flower pots in Hotels CLICK HERE

As a starter to help the idiot Stuart Agnew Godfrey is NOT a member of something called The Alliance he is a member of The EUrope of Freedom and Democracy - a corrupt grouping harbouring and promoting Racism, violent anti homosexuality, anti Judaism, Holocaust denial and pro EU Membership seeking reform as is he Stuart Agnew also UKIP's remaining MEPs willing to jump when told to put money in Nigel Farage's pocket. Godfrey Bloom is also a member of The Pan EU Alliance for Freedom.

Both the utterly vile EFD Group and this other grubby little group are increasingly within the bounds of Pan EU Political Parties or PEPPs.

Rerhaps it would be an intelligent action on these 'larded' self serving individuals to read up a little on the subject and to that end they will find this of help: CLICK HERE.

What is UKIP doing that is of any real benefit towards getting these United Kingdoms out of The EU - as yet they have never had a single training course of consequence and it was clear from todays debate they sure to hell need one. It is all very well waffling about policies and Government WE NEED MORE POLITICIANS LIKE A HOLE IN THE HEAD - The only reason UKIP gets votes is the stance of Leave-The-EU and on that clear message and by exploiting (dishonestly) the difficulties of other Parties in DOMESTIC politics UKIP does well in EU elections - the results when OTHER POLICIES are considered are risible as shown by their abject failure at Westminster elections and even worse results at local level!

Clearly and sadly to genuine supporters like myself who seek solutions for our Country and NOT enrichment or agrandisement for ourselves, it is increasingly clear that UKIP is unfit for purpose IF the aim is to liberate these United Kingdoms from membership of the malign and damaging EUropean Union.

All too often the ONLY answer UKIP has to any view point that may challenge their income stream as individuals is abuse or more hirelings and praise singers to abuse those who are genuine Patriots seeking to Leave-The-EU.

To quote Steve Allison of Nigel Farage:

"I don't question HIS recollection of the incident or HIS interpretation of the story. I'm sure he is sincere in his beliefs. Similarly I don't question anyone's belief in an almighty God. I'm sure they are sincere in their beliefs. I don't share those beliefs but it doesn't make me right and them wrong or visa versa. However, I know that you and I will never agree on this because there is no god but Farage and Heaver is his prophet so there is no point discussing it further really is there?"

This rather sums up UKIP's ability to debate - the nerds and sycophants of Farage and the rest - for a partial list of The Rest CLICK HERE.You will note amongst them already UKIP has lost 2 Council seats from the meager few it obtained on 06-May-2011 and also the recent resignation in apparent disgust at being used and abused of an NEC Member!

Hardly surprising having just watched 2 hours of ill informed and crassly uninformative debate that would surely not pass muster in a responsible 6th. Form let alone as a 'presentation' debate by such highly funded rascals. Though I will say afternoon tea at The Tiverton Hotel was pleasant!

Before moving on YOU may wish to watch the live stream which is 2 hours long and can be found if you CLICK HERE

COMMENTS:
Read In Reverse Order:

Michael Stone Great idea to show this live, hope it is not the last time.
Ben Walker *waves back at Chairman*
Julien Parrott Hello Steve!
OllyNeville @ Ivo in A PEP nigel would get even more speaking time
Edward Burroughs Off topic, but why does UKIP fail to attract women?
OllyNeville We can use money for UKIP, think tank, EU elections, pr.omotion of UKIP policies
Edward Burroughs If it takes the strain of the EU budget then that leaves more for fighting on the homefront
ivoweck Wwould this affect Nigel's 2 minute speeches in the EU parliment? 1 hour ago - Ignore - Delete
OllyNeville Hardly a long term committment, we can get out of it any time we want
Edward Burroughs Why cant the party incorporate some get out clauses in the constituiton in case it turns out bad?
Edward Burroughs Principles are all wella nd good, but money talks1
OllyNeville EU does this anyway, might as well get in there and take some of the money away from LibLabCon
Jason Smith If we could get the money to use for UKIP I'd be all in, but we can't use it to help us
OllyNeville having a think tank, being able to promote our policies will help us in UK elections a huge amount
david050268 the public need to see we could run the country if given the chance
Edward Burroughs Personally I cant see how this would detract from focusing on the UK, if there is no focus now
OllyNeville yes, UKIP need UK focus, if anything a PEP will help that
david050268 I agree the public need to see us as more than a one policy party and that we do have more policy's
Matt Davies I'm tired of UKIP being seen as an EU protest group. Put the focus back on the UK and I'll vote yes. 1 hour ago - Ignore - Delete
OllyNeville Having a think tank, and extra funding for UKIP policies promotion can help us nationally so much
Ben Walker I am now voting yes. UKIP needs to stand stronger - hence more money. 1 hour ago - Ignore - Delete
Matt Davies Let UKIP MEPs do what they want, but then have UKIP UK make it's own decisions by a leader based here.
Edward Burroughs Not if only MEPs join, surely?
OllyNeville If we arent in a PEP it wont focus us in the UK, being in a PEP may even help us be UK focus with xtra money
Matt Davies It does Olly, because it keeps UKIP going down the route of being under the control of the EU focused side.
Edward Burroughs Hi all: @ Matt, I dont see the PEP preventing further activity focused on the UK
OllyNeville @Matt that seems pretty sensible to me, need more UK focus, in or out of a PEP doesnt effect that
Michael Stone Stuart Agnew is a very hard working MEP both in brussels and around the eastern counties
Matt Davies I want to see some mechanism that will start UKIP being more UK focused. If not then I am voting NO
OllyNeville UKIP will not become a European wide party, UKIP is not joining the PEP only the MEPs
Matt Davies Here is my deal. I will vote Yes, if a UKIP UK unit is formed and give autonomy to run itself, free of MEP
OllyNeville No side seem to be more emotive Yes seems more to have the arguments 1 hour ago - Ignore - Delete
Noel Matthews @Matt I must be watching a different tream. The No side seems asleep here.
Jason Smith For Agnew to say if the UKIP membership vote No then I'll still join, that's disgusting
Ben Walker @Matt - that is an excellent idea!
Noel Matthews Stuart Agnew seems the most coherent to me
Matt Davies I'm not impressed with Agnew. Farage will be spitting feathers at his poor performance here.
Jason Smith Agnew should go as a MEP
Matt Davies UKIP should split into two units under one umbrella. A UK focused unit and an EU sabotage group. 1 hour ago - Ignore - Delete
OllyNeville MEPs will do what they do regardless of being in a PEP but might as well have more money while they do it
OllyNeville We can use PEP money to fight EU elections for UKIP, so we dotn have to spend UKIP money on EU elections
OllyNeville @david we already take money from the EU, so do LibLabCon, public dont care about it, they care about policy
david050268 we are hypocrites we want out the Eu but we can take money from them when we want. It would lose us votes
Julien Parrott This is a good question!
ivoweck UKIP would not do so well in UK elections if it wasn't for their MEPs
Jason Smith @Olly - but PEP money can only be used for EU releated activity
david050268 @Olly this is my point that if the public see us taking money from the EU for party use then they will say ..
OllyNeville yes, UKIP pick the policies, think tank researches them and gives them credibility
Matt Davies That's the problem though Olly. They won't focus on the UK while they are dancing to the EU's tune.
OllyNeville UKIP needs to focus almost soley on UK elections, no point wasting UKIP money on Eu elections, use PEP money
Matt Davies It's not a gift horse Olly. There are huge costs to UKIP. Principe, integrity and credibility.
Jason Smith @Olly - policies should be decided by our members, the people know what they want
Matt Davies UKIP need to focus on UK policies without EU restrictions and simply say we would leave if asked how.
OllyNeville @jason a political party cant study the effect of policies, a think tank can and so give credibility
david050268 @ivo Totally agree
OllyNeville theres no good from looking a gift horse in the mouth, take the EUs money and help us win in UK elections
david050268 They don't trust it because they don't know enough about UKIP 2 hours ago - Ignore - Delete
ivoweck To win MP, UKIP needs to become more than a one-issue party.
Matt Davies My view is UKIP's understandable obsession with the EU, turns voters off. They want a party that can run UK
Jason Smith @Olly - we don't need a think tank, if we can't generate our own policies we don't deserve to be a party
Matt Davies Noel, people know that. They don't vote UKIP though, because they don't trust it to run the country.
OllyNeville UKIP need to focus on domestic policies, having a think tank to help would be hugely useful
Matt Davies Is a parasitical approach to defeating the EU the only way to beat it? If so, are UKIP any better than the re
Ben Walker Off topic - but if UKIP wants to win MP's then it will have to do the Green party method - build a powerbase.
Noel Matthews @Matt All UKIP need to say is that a vote for UKIP is a vote for EU withdrawal. No referendum needed
Julien Parrott Democracy rules in UKIP we should not be apologising for this debate.
OllyNeville We need national focus, and if EU help can promote that national focus then take their money to crush themh
david050268 @Ben totally agree they don't need any more ammo to use against us 2 hours ago - Ignore - Delete
Matt Davies Who thinks the current EU focussed approach will see UKIP win seats at Westminster in our lifetiem?
Julien Parrott This is important because 60% of the membership has elected him leader
Noel Matthews I think the public would fall asleep on the PEP issue - it's been hard enough to understand for activists
Jason Smith Most MEPs and their staff are on the Yes camp, surprising that? :-) 2 hours ago - Ignore - Delete
Matt Davies If UKIP have to be within the EU structures to make a difference, then why don't we all just join the Tories?
Noel Matthews Farage is behind the Yes vote
Jason Smith @Ben - agreed, the media would destroy UKIP and would we would lose public support
david050268 The Mep's represent UKIP in the EU while the UK are in the EU
Alan Wood UKIP need to join an Alliance of anti-EU parties in UK, not Brussels.
Julien Parrott Is either side presenting the official view of Nigel Farage?
Matt Davies If UKIP can't win the political argument without the EU's condition attached coin. Then we are doomed.
Noel Matthews Political parties prosper the greater the funding but not often on principle alone
Jason Smith @Alan - agreed, in fact I believe MEPs will become more dependant on the EU